Latest message: 5 days, 12 hours ago
Conversi : Welcome to the Chat2024-08-21 02:51:37
chrisarnold : hello2024-09-09 00:57:04
maryseitz : Hi, Chris!2024-09-09 00:58:18
billybidwell : Hello, Chris and Mary2024-09-09 00:58:33 maryseitz : Hi, Billy!2024-09-09 00:58:54 chrisarnold : Hi Mary and Billy.2024-09-09 00:59:26 
shawnkafader : Hello everyone.2024-09-09 00:59:52 maryseitz : Hi, Shawn!2024-09-09 01:00:14 
meghogan : Hi all!2024-09-09 01:00:21
marthakrieg : Hi there!2024-09-09 01:00:40 maryseitz : Meg, how is your retreat going?2024-09-09 01:00:41 meghogan : Hi all!2024-09-09 01:00:42 billybidwell : They updated the Chatroom since I been here last2024-09-09 01:00:45 maryseitz : Hi, Martha!2024-09-09 01:01:01 
lornatatomir : Hi nice to see everyone here2024-09-09 01:01:25 meghogan : Mary, I leave tomorrow morning at the crack of dawn for Iowa!2024-09-09 01:01:26 marthakrieg : They had to switch the software; the older stuff just stopped working last month.2024-09-09 01:01:27 chrisarnold : a full house tonight!2024-09-09 01:01:46 chrisarnold : so for our chat on silence we'll all just not type for an hour, right?2024-09-09 01:02:10 maryseitz : Oh, Meg. I thought you were there already. I am not fond of zero dark thirty flights.2024-09-09 01:02:13 marthakrieg : Safe travels and a blessed retreat, Meg! Me, turning green...2024-09-09 01:02:28 maryseitz : Yuk yuk Chris. Maybe I will observe silence by trying to really appreciate and listen to everyone's comments.2024-09-09 01:02:54 shawnkafader : I like that idea, Chris...haha2024-09-09 01:03:02 meghogan : Chris: Ha-ha! Mary - the flight isn't until 9:30 but to get to the airport before rush hour I have to leave at 6:30.2024-09-09 01:03:09 lornatatomir : Yeah Meg have a wonderful time. Say Hi to some monks for me.2024-09-09 01:03:11 meghogan : I will say hi to everyone for everybody! I can't wait, either. The talk on silence came at just the right time!2024-09-09 01:04:15 lornatatomir : Wasn't that awesome talk so deep. We are silent listeners as much as we are noisy talkers. I need to work on the silent listener part. :))2024-09-09 01:04:59 
jenniferbelokur : hello, everyone!2024-09-09 01:05:13 meghogan : And on Saturday the AIC is having their usual monthly meeting, and I am going to be doing a very brief presentation on Conversi, because so many of the AIC are new since Covid.2024-09-09 01:05:16 shawnkafader : I too will be on a nine day silent retreat beginning this Wednesday at Our Lady of the Pines near Toledo, OH. Prayers are appreciated.2024-09-09 01:05:26 maryseitz : Hi, Jennifer.2024-09-09 01:05:30 meghogan : Hi Jennifer! A really full house!!2024-09-09 01:05:41 meghogan : Shawn - how great!!2024-09-09 01:06:05 maryseitz : Yes, Shawn. You two lucky ducks.2024-09-09 01:06:09 marthakrieg : Well, that means none of us has to type much to have a full discussion!2024-09-09 01:06:37 marthakrieg : How did you all feel about what Fr. David was saying? It seemed a different take from the usual in some ways.2024-09-09 01:07:35 meghogan : Lorna, I had a hard time following the talk, to be honest. But what I took from it was that silence is the path to liminality, and liminality is the path to "wonder and awe in God's presence" - which2024-09-09 01:07:55 meghogan : is how the Catholic confirmation ceremony describes "the fear of the Lord."2024-09-09 01:08:17 maryseitz : I would like to listen to it again and take notes by Wednesday, because as you said, Meg, there was so much there. It kind of flowed over me. I heard the part about liminality, which he repeated...2024-09-09 01:09:21 lornatatomir : I think that the talk was like a rich desert . You can't eat it all in one sitting. Lots of little bites. So much. and the Luminality of silence and Presence got me.2024-09-09 01:09:25 marthakrieg : (When first rewritten, the thread would update and you couldn't back up without its leaping forward. Now you have to watch the slider on the right - if it climbs the column, there's new stuff to see)2024-09-09 01:09:41 chrisarnold : I picked up on the bit about silence being receptivity, which is a thing I'd heard before. We make room for God to speak.2024-09-09 01:10:11 jenniferbelokur : I laughed when he said, "Silence is difficult to summarize." The whole point of the talk...lol2024-09-09 01:10:20 shawnkafader : My take away was the fact that we only know silence because we know the lack of silence. Kind of like a rest in music.2024-09-09 01:10:50 maryseitz : And also the cliff's notes version seemed to be, silence is everywhere within and without, even to the understanding of why there is suffering.2024-09-09 01:10:50 chrisarnold : My favorite book on silence is diarmaid macculloch's "Silence: A Christian History" because he spends 2/3 of the book talking about spirituality, and then 1/3 of the book talking about...2024-09-09 01:12:04 meghogan : One of my take aways was that silence is the only appropriate response to stunning, overflowing Reality. Words would trivialize it.2024-09-09 01:12:07 maryseitz : Martha, I am so glad we can scroll up and down now!!!2024-09-09 01:12:20 chrisarnold : ...coverups, injustice, abuse scandals, complicity. It was good but painful.2024-09-09 01:12:31 shawnkafader : Yes, Jennifer, I was struck by that comment too...especially from someone I thought would be an expert on silence.2024-09-09 01:12:38 chrisarnold : Early on he asserted that "silence is not a thing". That was maybe 13 minutes in? I chewed on that for a while.2024-09-09 01:14:12 marthakrieg : He didn't dwell on how hard it is to silence the *internal* chatter, even when our mouths are shut and nobody is around to see our expressions and body language.2024-09-09 01:14:19 billybidwell : Yes, words about God often trivialize God.2024-09-09 01:15:00 chrisarnold : Because it feels like a thing. We "enter" silence. We feel the weight of silence in silent spaces. But all it is is an absence. Which just highlights the omnipresent nature of noise.2024-09-09 01:15:08 billybidwell : I have a lot of chatter going on in my mind. Especially when I need to be silent.2024-09-09 01:16:20 jenniferbelokur : me too, billy2024-09-09 01:16:49 marthakrieg : Like the dark in a deep cave with no artificial light. The absence of light and the absence of sound are both disorienting.2024-09-09 01:16:54 shawnkafader : Total silence, like total darkness, is difficult to experience. There is always some noise.2024-09-09 01:17:09 meghogan : It's not a "thing", but it seems to have a texture, a kind of feeling. It's certainly different from noise (as opposed to sound.) Gregorian chant is sound leading to silence, but the TV's in waiting2024-09-09 01:17:16 meghogan : rooms are just noise.2024-09-09 01:17:29 marthakrieg : Or how we create things to internally comment on by flouncing about in our chair, bouncing a foot, clicking a fountain pen...2024-09-09 01:18:04 chrisarnold : The other day I was leading a retreat and I kept telling people that it's absence of talking, not absence of all sound. Don't worry about putting your mug back on the table!2024-09-09 01:18:15 lornatatomir : Chris What about that rare rich Presence in silence and sometimes a thought or a question. Please explain absence..do you mean like absence of the noises of our life as all is absence .2024-09-09 01:18:21 billybidwell : Our society is all about drowning everything in noise. It's hard to get away from it.2024-09-09 01:18:59 maryseitz : Yes, Billy, me too. I'm getting some functional medicine and one seemingly unrelated treatment is 6m of slow diaphragm breathing 2x/day. Wow am I glad to be required to do that. I wish I could just...2024-09-09 01:19:05 maryseitz : do it for the love of God but I guess I need motivation.2024-09-09 01:19:25 meghogan : Ask Him for the motivation!!2024-09-09 01:19:53 maryseitz : He gave me the motivation. Very humbling, Meg. God does indeed meet you where you're at.2024-09-09 01:20:54 lornatatomir : To Mary ...well if you measured your blood pressure before you do that and your blood pressure after you do, that if would show a lower rate....if you want to see if it works. just for fun.2024-09-09 01:21:02 billybidwell : I do think that focusing on something like breathing helps me to clear my mind of distractions.2024-09-09 01:21:33 maryseitz : Lorna, ha ha. I will have to try it. Usually I'm doing it at midnight and stressed because I'm not yet in bed. Well, progress not perfection.2024-09-09 01:22:47 shawnkafader : I love it when I can experience an interior silence in spite of the exterior noise.2024-09-09 01:25:10 chrisarnold : How do you cultivate silence, stillness, and quiet in your own lives?2024-09-09 01:25:19 shawnkafader : Yesterday my Lectio was on Psalm 107. The phrase that connected with me was verse 29a - He made the storm be still.2024-09-09 01:26:12 marthakrieg : Mary, a Fitbit or Apple Watch would probably have your heart rate without much effort. I know I can feel heart rate and blood pressure both drop the minute the cat lands on my lap (unless he's got the2024-09-09 01:26:17 marthakrieg : zoomies or is being loudly demanding)2024-09-09 01:26:29 maryseitz : Great idea, Martha! I will do that and report back to Lorna.2024-09-09 01:27:13 billybidwell : I try to stay centered on the present moment and see the world with the knowledge that God sees the world with me.2024-09-09 01:27:15 shawnkafader : Chris, I seem to settle into silence in the midst of reading or prayer.2024-09-09 01:27:28 marthakrieg : I recently started beginning my contemplative time with the phrase, "Speak Lord, thy servant is listening" ... sometimes that by itself begins the process of toning down and muting other chatter.2024-09-09 01:28:06 meghogan : To Chris - I don't have noise going just to have noise, like having music playing at home all the time. IWe rarely watch TV now. But I could do better. What I try to do is focus on the face of2024-09-09 01:29:01 meghogan : of Christ and try to love him.2024-09-09 01:29:21 jenniferbelokur : meg, I've been trying to do that, too.2024-09-09 01:30:05 maryseitz : Chris, seriously, the 6m of breathing before I sit in silence is God's huge gift to me. I do that, and I also don't listen to many podcasts or youtube or music. Although my brain still goes buzzing.2024-09-09 01:30:19 meghogan : (I first typed "the face of Chris" but realized that was a typo!)2024-09-09 01:30:21 chrisarnold : Yes, so it's not just auditory and mental noise, but visual simplicity, too. I try to focus on simple symbols or general nature (a lake or some trees...)2024-09-09 01:30:28 chrisarnold : YOu can try to love me too, Meg! 🙂2024-09-09 01:30:53 meghogan : 🙂2024-09-09 01:31:23 chrisarnold : (The number of worship aids that have printed "Alleluia, Chris is risen"... people always point that out to me...)2024-09-09 01:31:43 meghogan : Yes, the visual simplicity is really important too - part of why Cistercian spirituality appeals to me. The church at New Melleray is so simple but so beautiful.2024-09-09 01:32:30 marthakrieg : Well, you got to the service, so I guess you did rise...2024-09-09 01:33:33 shawnkafader : I recall reading in the Rule the other day that the monks should leave the chapel as quietly as possible so that if someone wants to stay in silence2024-09-09 01:34:01 billybidwell : Yes, the church that I go to has too many distractions. They tried too hard to make it look "European"2024-09-09 01:34:15 marthakrieg : I appreciate the Cistercian simplicity - but do not at all keep my house that way!2024-09-09 01:34:15 shawnkafader : they are not dsiturbed.2024-09-09 01:34:17 meghogan : My husband says "Alleluia Meg is risen" a lot because I am so NOT a morning person!2024-09-09 01:34:21 lornatatomir : Just one example Because I have white coat syndrome and I had to learn to get it down to normal via «link removed»2024-09-09 01:34:32 jenniferbelokur : Martha, I dream of living a simple life. haha2024-09-09 01:34:47 billybidwell : I wish I could keep my house with simplicity, but I can't get rid of my books.2024-09-09 01:35:53 meghogan : Yeah, that's the major issue at our house, too.2024-09-09 01:36:29 marthakrieg : Yes, the minute I clean off a flat surface, it starts to accrete everything from squirrel-chewed nut shells to spools of thread, screwdrivers and sandpaper, saddle soap - you name it. And it's mine..2024-09-09 01:36:39 chrisarnold : The whole house doesn't necessarily have to have simplicity. But the prayer space should.2024-09-09 01:36:45 meghogan : I just close my eyes, Chris2024-09-09 01:37:17 marthakrieg : There is no separate prayer space, Chris. If I sit in a particular chair, I can see my icons. But I'm usually on the couch, so I just close my eyes.2024-09-09 01:37:41 maryseitz : I can't even approach Cistercian monastic simplicity but I am verrrry slowly making progress with visual and household clutter and having visual on-purposeness at least.2024-09-09 01:38:00 chrisarnold : If I close my eyes, I nod off. 🙂2024-09-09 01:38:13 jenniferbelokur : Wow! A prayer space is another dream...2024-09-09 01:38:59 jenniferbelokur : Chris, lol2024-09-09 01:39:16 meghogan : Any thoughts on the "solitude" part of this topic? I find I need it more the older I get.2024-09-09 01:39:38 shawnkafader : Due to some eyesight problems I have difficulty reading most physical books. I have almost transferred all of my books to electronic version. I have given2024-09-09 01:40:00 shawnkafader : most of my physical library away. Very tidy.2024-09-09 01:40:19 marthakrieg : I have always needed solitude -it was almost scary how much I did NOT mind the isolation during the Covid lockdown...2024-09-09 01:40:33 chrisarnold : Again, solitude isn't necessarily total isolation from people. My favorite kind of solitude is being alone in a big crowd, like an airport terminal.2024-09-09 01:40:35 billybidwell : I think solitude works best with silence.2024-09-09 01:41:09 maryseitz : Chris, that is so weird but true! I have noticed that.2024-09-09 01:41:28 marthakrieg : Not me, Chris - because I always have to keep some awareness of the others around me so they don't assault or kidnap me, or steal. (My husband lost a couple of passports on trips abroad...)2024-09-09 01:41:56 billybidwell : Detachment versus solitude?2024-09-09 01:42:08 chrisarnold : I actually prefer having other people near, but just not interacting with them.2024-09-09 01:42:12 shawnkafader : I agree, Billy.2024-09-09 01:42:48 meghogan : Well Chris, one of my favorite solitudes is sitting in the big recliner in the Guest House at Our Lady of the Mississippi and knowing that there is a whole2024-09-09 01:43:22 marthakrieg : Mostly I just want a cat or dog...2024-09-09 01:43:30 meghogan : community I will shortly join for the Liturgy of the Hours.2024-09-09 01:43:43 marthakrieg : I can enjoy working with people on things - but a lot of what I enjoy doing requires intense concentration and pickiness.2024-09-09 01:45:12 chrisarnold : The Father spoke one Word, which was His Son, and this Word He always speaks in eternal silence, and in silence must it be heard by the soul. - St. John of the Cross2024-09-09 01:45:26 maryseitz : Martha, you and I share a fondness for four legged prayer companions.2024-09-09 01:46:27 lornatatomir : Hard to beat St.John of the Cross. Thanks2024-09-09 01:46:50 lornatatomir : Blessings.2024-09-09 01:47:25 marthakrieg : Mary - chuckle! They are warm and non-critical, and they can hold very, very still for hours if they choose!2024-09-09 01:48:03 shawnkafader : I am struck by the fact that we are having a conversation this evening without hearing any words...a form of shared silence.2024-09-09 01:49:03 marthakrieg : Don't you hear them in your head when you read the post?2024-09-09 01:49:33 shawnkafader : Yes, but I do not know what many of your voices sound like.2024-09-09 01:50:16 marthakrieg : Ah! Come to the Wednesday chat and meet more of us live!2024-09-09 01:51:29 meghogan : I get it, Shawn. It's just different.2024-09-09 01:51:31 meghogan : I got so burned out on Zoom during Covid. All the classes I taught in the parish had to be done on Zoom. Argh! Although I will say we prepared many family pets to be sponsors at Baptism! They sat2024-09-09 01:52:50 billybidwell : Yes, I am in solitude, but I am with you all.2024-09-09 01:52:53 meghogan : and listened to the classes with their human parents!2024-09-09 01:53:03 maryseitz : I don't think I am experiencing silence right now. At least, maybe on one level. But these chats get me all wound up and engaged. Too many monkeys in my mind (not meaning y'all) to qualify as silence.2024-09-09 01:53:28 billybidwell : I have a monkey mind too.2024-09-09 01:54:14 marthakrieg : I'm down to about 6 Zoom chats a month (one weekly, two others once a month) and that's doable - more becomes too much very quickly.2024-09-09 01:54:49 shawnkafader : Makes me wonder...if these kinds of chats took place in the monastic community would they be considered noise or silence? (Just wondering...)2024-09-09 01:55:19 marthakrieg : But it beats not going to meetings because of a need to avoid infection.2024-09-09 01:55:22 marthakrieg : Meg, why don't you ask Shawn's question while you are there?2024-09-09 01:56:15 maryseitz : Shawn, does sign language in the monastery count as silence? There could be a parallel?2024-09-09 01:56:21 meghogan : Shawn, I think they would be considered edifying speech. They are not chatter; we're not just "talking" to hear the sound of our own voices, but to2024-09-09 01:56:31 meghogan : edify each other.2024-09-09 01:56:38 meghogan : But yes, if I remember I will ask, Martha. Good idea.2024-09-09 01:56:58 shawnkafader : A humorous image...monks sitting around with laptops chatting away...2024-09-09 01:57:23 chrisarnold : Lord, grant us a love of the silence in which you speak throughout eternity. Tune the ears of our hearts to hear you, and reveal your presence beyond the sound.2024-09-09 01:57:29 marthakrieg : Though I think my brain is getting past the point of absorbing more edifying information. It feels like a long day... and I need to take the granddaughter to school tomorrow..2024-09-09 01:57:38 jenniferbelokur : I must go, everyone. I enjoyed typing with all of you and I hope you feel God's blessings this month!2024-09-09 01:57:47 meghogan : Great chat tonight! Thanks all for coming!!2024-09-09 01:58:14 maryseitz : Thanks, Chris. Goodnight and God Bless, everyone.2024-09-09 01:58:19 shawnkafader : Blessings everyone. Good to be together tonight!2024-09-09 01:58:31 marthakrieg : Shawn, while counseling with our pastor many years ago, he jokingly said he had an image of the two of us like that, and was surprised when we said he was right!2024-09-09 01:58:34 chrisarnold : Prayers for all of you. This week, I schedule the meeting with my bishop about the possibility of being released from my orders. That will be hard.2024-09-09 01:58:41 maryseitz : Meg, safe travels tomorrow.2024-09-09 01:58:44 billybidwell : Thank you, everyone! Good Night2024-09-09 01:58:57 maryseitz : Chris what do you mean?2024-09-09 01:59:15 marthakrieg : Oh, Chris! I'll pray for you!2024-09-09 01:59:19 chrisarnold : Peace! Sleep well.2024-09-09 01:59:21 meghogan : Prayers for you, Chris2024-09-09 01:59:25 meghogan : Thanks, Mary2024-09-09 01:59:35 chrisarnold : Mary, I'll write a journal entry about it, but it seems I'm leaving the Episcopal Church. Which means leaving the priesthood.2024-09-09 01:59:58 meghogan : Good night all.2024-09-09 02:00:04 maryseitz : Chris, where ever life takes you I'll pray for you.2024-09-09 02:00:07 chrisarnold : Good night!2024-09-09 02:00:24 maryseitz : Please do write about it.2024-09-09 02:00:36 maryseitz : Bye all!2024-09-09 02:01:00 
